I know that if your ball hits a ball on the green, but you're hitting from off the green, then you play your ball as it lies, and the other player puts his ball back where it was. If both balls are on the green, then it's a two stroke penalty on the player that hit the putt (Rule 19-5a). (Don't do this).
But what happens if both balls are off the green?
As far as I can tell, this is covered by 18-5 for the player whose ball is hit (put it back), and 19-5 for the player whose ball did the hitting (play as it lies).
It kinda bugs me on the PGA Tour when players leave their ball on the green as a potential backstop when another player is chipping. It's kinda cheating, isn't it? They only seem to do it when playing with a buddy. I don't think we will see that happen in the Ryder Cup next weekend.
Saturday, September 15, 2018
Monday, September 10, 2018
9/9/18 - The Crossings at Carlsbad
The Crossings just aerated their greens, so they had great rates for the weekend. I booked a 6:27am tee time. It's barely light at 6:27am this time of year. And it can be really foggy. Amazingly, I only lost one ball, and that was after the fog had burned off.
So what does this have to do with the rules? After I played, I wasn't sure if I should post my score, given the conditions of the greens. Everyone else in the foursome indicated that it was 2-putt max. That sounds a lot like a breakfast ball, a mulligan, or a gimme - common, but not within the rules of golf (ie cheating).
So I consulted with our handicap chair. He pointed me at the list below:
Those are the only reasons not to post a score (USGA Handicap Manual, Section 5-1e). And since aeration isn't on the list, then I have to post the score. I have to. It's not optional. Even with all of those 3-putts....
It makes sense because weather impacts the course conditions, what time of day you play has an impact, and you still post regardless of those, so why wouldn't you post on aerated greens?
I was surprised to learn that you can't post a round that you played solo. I did not know that. I will stop posting those scores.
Another interesting thing that I did not know is Section 5-1d. If you are DQ'ed from a tournament, you still need to post an adjusted gross score (what you would have scored, with all appropriate penalties, etc).
This is all enumerated in great detail here:
http://www.usga.org/handicapping/handicap-manual.html#!rule-14379
So you should be posting pretty much all of your rounds. Even the good ones that lower your handicap... ;)
*I'm curious about what a non-conforming tee is. I'll have to look into that one....
Thanks to our Handicap Chair, Noel for providing most of this information.
So what does this have to do with the rules? After I played, I wasn't sure if I should post my score, given the conditions of the greens. Everyone else in the foursome indicated that it was 2-putt max. That sounds a lot like a breakfast ball, a mulligan, or a gimme - common, but not within the rules of golf (ie cheating).
So I consulted with our handicap chair. He pointed me at the list below:
(i) When fewer than seven holes are played;
(ii) When made on a golf course in an area in which an inactive season established by the Authorized Golf Association is in effect;
(iii) When, as a condition of the competition, the maximum number of clubs allowed is less than 14, or types of clubs are limited as, for example, in a competition that allows only iron clubs;
(iv) When scores are made on a course with no USGA Course Rating or Slope Rating;
(v) When a player uses non-conforming clubs, non-conforming balls, or non-conforming tees*; or when a player incurs a second breach of Rule 14-3.
(vi) When a player plays alone;
(vii) When a player ignores one or more Rules of Golf and fails to post an adjusted hole score as required under Section 4-1 and 4-2, or fails to record the appropriate penalty for a breach of rule. For example, if a player anchored the club while making a stroke during a round and did not record a penalty for doing so (See Rule 14-1b), the score would not have been played under the Rules of Golf and therefore would not be acceptable for handicap purposes.
Those are the only reasons not to post a score (USGA Handicap Manual, Section 5-1e). And since aeration isn't on the list, then I have to post the score. I have to. It's not optional. Even with all of those 3-putts....
It makes sense because weather impacts the course conditions, what time of day you play has an impact, and you still post regardless of those, so why wouldn't you post on aerated greens?
I was surprised to learn that you can't post a round that you played solo. I did not know that. I will stop posting those scores.
Another interesting thing that I did not know is Section 5-1d. If you are DQ'ed from a tournament, you still need to post an adjusted gross score (what you would have scored, with all appropriate penalties, etc).
This is all enumerated in great detail here:
http://www.usga.org/handicapping/handicap-manual.html#!rule-14379
So you should be posting pretty much all of your rounds. Even the good ones that lower your handicap... ;)
*I'm curious about what a non-conforming tee is. I'll have to look into that one....
Thanks to our Handicap Chair, Noel for providing most of this information.
Saturday, September 1, 2018
9/1/2018 - Castle Creek
It's been a while since I last posted. It's not that I haven't been playing, I just haven't encountered any interesting rules questions. Or if I have, I didn't remember them when the round was over.
Today, I hit a bad chip that went over the green and came to rest about a foot from a maintenance shed. I had no stance, no swing, and I was pretty sure that I should get relief....
I was right. Unless it's out of bounds, the maintenance shed is an immovable obstruction. So I get relief based on Rule 24-2 - Immovable Obstruction.
This rule only applies to stance and swing. If the ball had ended up 20 yards over the maintenance shed, with the shed directly between me and the green, then I get no relief. I have to either go over, around, or through.
As with most free relief, it's a free drop within one club-length of the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole.
Today, I hit a bad chip that went over the green and came to rest about a foot from a maintenance shed. I had no stance, no swing, and I was pretty sure that I should get relief....
I was right. Unless it's out of bounds, the maintenance shed is an immovable obstruction. So I get relief based on Rule 24-2 - Immovable Obstruction.
This rule only applies to stance and swing. If the ball had ended up 20 yards over the maintenance shed, with the shed directly between me and the green, then I get no relief. I have to either go over, around, or through.
As with most free relief, it's a free drop within one club-length of the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole.
Sunday, June 24, 2018
6/23/18 - Carmel Mountain Ranch
Carmel Mountain Ranch is closing next month, which is sad. Maybe that explains why when we got to the 14th tee, there were no blue tee markers. What to do? Rule 11-4 says that it's a two stroke penalty to play from outside the teeing ground. Decision 11-4 says that the correct procedure is to discontinue play until the committee resolves the problem. No one was behind us, but holding up play for that sort of thing would not be looked upon kindly in Southern California.
Decision 11-4 also indicates that if the players play from their best estimate of where the teeing ground should be (based on the other tee markers), then there is no penalty, if no advantage is gained. That seems reasonable.
My first thought would be to play from the embedded USGA / SCGA markers, but CMR doesn't have those.
Decision 11-4 also indicates that if the players play from their best estimate of where the teeing ground should be (based on the other tee markers), then there is no penalty, if no advantage is gained. That seems reasonable.
My first thought would be to play from the embedded USGA / SCGA markers, but CMR doesn't have those.
Thursday, June 21, 2018
6/20/18 - Mission Trails
We were playing the blue tees, and I hit the worst tee shot you can imagine on the second hole. It came to rest up against the forward tee marker. I was pretty sure that it was a movable obstruction, so that's how I played it. If Tiger's boulder in Phoenix was a movable obstruction, then this fist-sized rock surely was, right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xadPSF3H2Wo&feature=youtu.be
Turns out that I was right. This is covered by Rule 11-2, and Decision 11-2/1. The tee markers are fixed prior to the first stroke, and movable obstructions thereafter.
In our club, the penalty for not clearing the front tee markers with your drive is ridicule, and playing the remainder of the hole with a pink ball (if available), or playing the remainder of the round with a pink tee (if available). You've probably heard of worse.
Rule 11 also covers teeing off from the wrong tees. It's a two-stroke penalty. So my best round at Torrey Pines North is an 87, not an 85. Actually, I didn't correct it, so it's a DQ! :|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xadPSF3H2Wo&feature=youtu.be
Turns out that I was right. This is covered by Rule 11-2, and Decision 11-2/1. The tee markers are fixed prior to the first stroke, and movable obstructions thereafter.
In our club, the penalty for not clearing the front tee markers with your drive is ridicule, and playing the remainder of the hole with a pink ball (if available), or playing the remainder of the round with a pink tee (if available). You've probably heard of worse.
Rule 11 also covers teeing off from the wrong tees. It's a two-stroke penalty. So my best round at Torrey Pines North is an 87, not an 85. Actually, I didn't correct it, so it's a DQ! :|
Saturday, June 9, 2018
6/9/18 - Arrowood
I referenced Decision 16/5.5 on the course today, as I had done exactly that:
17-4 - Ball Resting Against Flagstick
Basically if your hole-in-one has not fallen below the level of the cup, then it's not hole-in-one yet. Be very careful when removing the flagstick. If the ball comes out, then you have to place it on the lip.
16-2/0.5 is really interesting:
Of course all of this could change the first of next year....
16/5.5 Player Holes Short Putt and Allegedly Removes Ball from Hole Before It Is at RestThere are a number of interesting rules / decisions for scenarios like this:
Q.A player strikes a short putt into the hole and removes the ball from the hole. His opponent or a fellow-competitor claims he heard the ball bouncing in the bottom of the hole-liner at the time the player was removing the ball from the hole, and therefore the ball cannot be considered holed in view of the Definition of "Holed" which states: "A ball is holed when it is at rest within the circumference of the hole ...". What is the ruling?
A.The ball is holed. The words "at rest" are in the Definition of "Holed" to make it clear that if a ball falls below the lip and thereafter bounces out, it is not holed.
17-4 - Ball Resting Against Flagstick
Basically if your hole-in-one has not fallen below the level of the cup, then it's not hole-in-one yet. Be very careful when removing the flagstick. If the ball comes out, then you have to place it on the lip.
16-2/0.5 is really interesting:
16-2/0.5 Ball Overhanging Hole Is Lifted, Cleaned and Replaced; Ball Then Falls into Hole
Q.After an approach shot, a player's ball is overhanging the hole. The player walks up to the hole without unreasonable delay and notices that there is mud on the ball. The player marks the position of the ball and lifts it. He then cleans the ball and replaces it. The ball remains on the lip of the hole for about five seconds and then, as the player is preparing to tap it into the hole, the ball falls into the hole. What is the ruling?
A.Under Rule 16-2, if a ball falls into the hole after it is deemed to be at rest, the player is deemed to have holed out with his last stroke and he shall add a penalty stroke to his score for the hole. In this case, when the player marked the position of the ball it must have been at rest. The ball must be considered to have been at rest when it was replaced; otherwise, it would have to be replaced again (Rule 20-3d).
Accordingly, the player is deemed to have holed out with his last stroke and must add a penalty stroke to his score for the hole.
Of course all of this could change the first of next year....
Tuesday, May 29, 2018
5/28/2018 - Sea 'n Air
Due to the collapse of the driving range fence onto the first fairway, hole #1 at Sea 'n Air has been shortened from a 500 yard par 5 (from the blue tees) to a 240 yard par 4. So how do you post a score?
Section 5-2g of the USGA handicap manual covers this:
http://www.usga.org/handicapping/handicap-manual.html#!rule-14379
According to the table, 260 yards equates to -1.4 on the course rating, and -3 for the slope. For men, from the blue tees, this is:
Rating = 70.6 - 1.4 = 69.2
Slope = 126 - 3 = 123
So if the course is playing 260 yards shorter than the rating, then you post manually, using these revised numbers.
Section 5-2g of the USGA handicap manual covers this:
http://www.usga.org/handicapping/handicap-manual.html#!rule-14379
According to the table, 260 yards equates to -1.4 on the course rating, and -3 for the slope. For men, from the blue tees, this is:
Rating = 70.6 - 1.4 = 69.2
Slope = 126 - 3 = 123
So if the course is playing 260 yards shorter than the rating, then you post manually, using these revised numbers.
Sunday, May 13, 2018
5/5/2018 - St. Mark's
We had a couple of unusual rulings to make in our foursome at St.
Mark's last weekend. The first was casual water on the green, which
doesn't happen in San Diego very much, especially in May.
Rule 25-1 indicates that an abnormal ground condition exists if the ball is on the putting green, and casual water is in your putting line. If you are off the green (even in the fringe), then you would only get relief if the abnormal ground condition interfered with your stance or swing, not the line to the flag. But on the green, you are entitled to relief if the casual water is in the line of the putt. Relief is to the nearest point of relief, not closer to the hole, which may be off of the putting green. Off of the green, you would drop the ball, but on the green, you would place it.
The second was a boundary fence interfering with the swing of a player. Normally, a fence interfering with your swing would be an immovable obstruction. In this scenario, free relief is available if the fence interferes with your stance or swing, but not if it is just in your line of play (see 3/17/18 - Riverwalk). In the case it's a boundary fence, and so the fence itself is out of bounds, and cannot be moved. This is noted on the scorecard. So you can either play the ball as it lies, or take an unplayable lie and a one-stroke penalty.
Rule 25-1 indicates that an abnormal ground condition exists if the ball is on the putting green, and casual water is in your putting line. If you are off the green (even in the fringe), then you would only get relief if the abnormal ground condition interfered with your stance or swing, not the line to the flag. But on the green, you are entitled to relief if the casual water is in the line of the putt. Relief is to the nearest point of relief, not closer to the hole, which may be off of the putting green. Off of the green, you would drop the ball, but on the green, you would place it.
The second was a boundary fence interfering with the swing of a player. Normally, a fence interfering with your swing would be an immovable obstruction. In this scenario, free relief is available if the fence interferes with your stance or swing, but not if it is just in your line of play (see 3/17/18 - Riverwalk). In the case it's a boundary fence, and so the fence itself is out of bounds, and cannot be moved. This is noted on the scorecard. So you can either play the ball as it lies, or take an unplayable lie and a one-stroke penalty.
Sunday, April 1, 2018
4/1/2018 - Woods Valley
My drive on #2 hit a power line (and was never seen again). I know it's a common local rule when a power line is nearby, so I checked the scorecard:
I was wondering what the ruling would be without the local rule, and I was curious about the reference to Rule 20-5. The second part is easy, but I had to look it up. Rule 20-5 is all of the various rules for dropping the ball (or in this case, re-teeing it).
As far as I can tell, without that local rule, you would have to play the ball where it lays. In my case, I couldn't find it, so I would have had to re-tee, hitting my third shot.
Other than a pair of 8's on the two toughest holes, it was a pretty good round (87 - it's good for me!)
If a ball strikes the power lines during play on the 2nd and 8th holes, the stroke is cancelled, and the player must replay his shot without penalty (Rule 20-5). (emphasis mine)This is based on a USGA local rule when power lines can interfere with a well-played shot. The USGA doesn't want you to have the option of playing the ball where it lays. You must re-play the shot (Decision 33-8/13).
I was wondering what the ruling would be without the local rule, and I was curious about the reference to Rule 20-5. The second part is easy, but I had to look it up. Rule 20-5 is all of the various rules for dropping the ball (or in this case, re-teeing it).
As far as I can tell, without that local rule, you would have to play the ball where it lays. In my case, I couldn't find it, so I would have had to re-tee, hitting my third shot.
Other than a pair of 8's on the two toughest holes, it was a pretty good round (87 - it's good for me!)
Sunday, March 18, 2018
3/17/2018 - Riverwalk
Our monthly tournament for March was at Riverwalk. It was raining when we teed off, so we (the board) had decided to adopt a local rule for lift, clean, and place. It stopped raining shortly after we started, so I don't believe anyone in our group used this local rule. I'm not sure about other foursomes.
On the first hole of the Mission 9, one player ended up near a hazard, and behind a low wooden fence. He asked if he could get relief, and we collectively decided that since the fence didn't impact his stance or his swing, that he was not entitled to relief. I was pretty sure that was the right decision, but I wanted to look it up.
The fence is considered an immovable obstruction. Rule 24-2 covers this scenario. On the green, an immovable obstruction on the line of play would entitle the player to relief. But if the ball is not on the putting green, then an immovable obstruction in your line of play does not qualify you for relief. You shouldn't have hit it over there. Sorry, Jeff, but I'm glad we got the rule right.
On the first hole of the Mission 9, one player ended up near a hazard, and behind a low wooden fence. He asked if he could get relief, and we collectively decided that since the fence didn't impact his stance or his swing, that he was not entitled to relief. I was pretty sure that was the right decision, but I wanted to look it up.
The fence is considered an immovable obstruction. Rule 24-2 covers this scenario. On the green, an immovable obstruction on the line of play would entitle the player to relief. But if the ball is not on the putting green, then an immovable obstruction in your line of play does not qualify you for relief. You shouldn't have hit it over there. Sorry, Jeff, but I'm glad we got the rule right.
Sunday, February 18, 2018
2/18/2018 - Balboa
Is bird crap a loose impediment?
Yes. The definition of loose impediments includes:
Yes. The definition of loose impediments includes:
- stones, leaves, twigs, branches and the like,
- dung, and
- worms, insects and the like and the casts made by them, provided they are not:
- fixed or growing,
- solidly embedded, or,
- adhering to the ball
Monday, January 29, 2018
1/28/2018 - Farmers Insurance Open
I attended The Farmers Insurance Open yesterday, and I almost saw a spectator step on a ball in play. It didn't happen, but it could have. So what's the ruling?
The best I could figure, that would be a ball at rest moved by an outside agency (Rule 18-1). But it gets interesting from there. According to Rule 18-1, the ball must be replaced. I don't think you could get the ball to hover above the hole created by stepping on it, but Rule 18-1, Note 2 refers to rule 20-3b in the scenario that the original lie has been altered. Rule 20-3b says that you must place the ball in the nearest lie most similar to the original lie that is not more than one club-length from the original lie, and not closer to the hole.
My first thought was that you should drop the ball in accordance with Rule 25-2 (Embedded Ball), but I think placing the ball is more correct in this scenario.
The best I could figure, that would be a ball at rest moved by an outside agency (Rule 18-1). But it gets interesting from there. According to Rule 18-1, the ball must be replaced. I don't think you could get the ball to hover above the hole created by stepping on it, but Rule 18-1, Note 2 refers to rule 20-3b in the scenario that the original lie has been altered. Rule 20-3b says that you must place the ball in the nearest lie most similar to the original lie that is not more than one club-length from the original lie, and not closer to the hole.
My first thought was that you should drop the ball in accordance with Rule 25-2 (Embedded Ball), but I think placing the ball is more correct in this scenario.
Monday, January 1, 2018
1/1/2018 - Happy New Year!
You may have heard mention of the new golf rules coming into effect for 2018, but there aren't any. The new rules you've heard about don't go into effect until 2019.
Some of the proposed rule changes are pretty major. Some highlights:
USGA - Major Proposed Changes
If you happen to play on the PGA Tour (or other high-level tours), then you won't have to worry about Joe Couch Potato calling in a penalty:
Common sense prevails as fans can no longer call in golf rules violations
Are they going to call that the Lexi Thompson rule?
I'll probably be writing more on these as the year wears on. My first question is if the new rule 11.1 (see first link above) would take away the penalty double-contact. My reading is that it would.
Some of the proposed rule changes are pretty major. Some highlights:
- Accidentally moving your ball would no longer be a penalty.
- Relief will be in inches, not club-lengths
- You can only search for a lost ball for three minutes instead of five minutes
- Free relief for embedded ball in the rough (our club has already adopted this as a club local rule)
- You will be allowed to repair any damage on the green (not just a ball mark)
- No penalty for hitting the flagstick with a putt
USGA - Major Proposed Changes
If you happen to play on the PGA Tour (or other high-level tours), then you won't have to worry about Joe Couch Potato calling in a penalty:
Common sense prevails as fans can no longer call in golf rules violations
Are they going to call that the Lexi Thompson rule?
I'll probably be writing more on these as the year wears on. My first question is if the new rule 11.1 (see first link above) would take away the penalty double-contact. My reading is that it would.
Saturday, December 30, 2017
12/24/17 - Blacklake
I played a course that I wasn't really familiar with on Christmas Eve, and I encountered an unusual local rule.
I hit my approach shot into what looked like it had once been a lake. With the drought in California, it's not that unusual to see ex-lakes. It was marked with blue-tipped stakes. I assumed it was a hazard, so I took a drop (and a penalty stroke) and hit my approach to the green.
The local rule indicated that the areas surrounded by blue-tipped stakes should be played as casual water. Free relief. Odd.
I had already posted my score when I noticed the local rule on the scorecard (see below). Hopefully my handicap chair can fix it.
I hit my approach shot into what looked like it had once been a lake. With the drought in California, it's not that unusual to see ex-lakes. It was marked with blue-tipped stakes. I assumed it was a hazard, so I took a drop (and a penalty stroke) and hit my approach to the green.
The local rule indicated that the areas surrounded by blue-tipped stakes should be played as casual water. Free relief. Odd.
I had already posted my score when I noticed the local rule on the scorecard (see below). Hopefully my handicap chair can fix it.
Monday, December 11, 2017
12/9/17 - San Vicente
A player in our foursome asked about relief from a staked tree. I had never heard of such a rule, so I had to look it up.
It's a Local Rule that can be adopted - Protection of Young Trees. It's in Appendix I, Part A, Section 2b. Under this rule, the marked tree would be treated as an Immovable Obstruction (Rule 24-2b). This is a free drop within one club-length of the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole.
There was nothing about it on the scorecard, but the fact that the course staked the trees implies to me that they expect the local rule to be in place. Of course the player didn't ask about it until after he had played (without taking relief).
You learn something new with every round...
It's a Local Rule that can be adopted - Protection of Young Trees. It's in Appendix I, Part A, Section 2b. Under this rule, the marked tree would be treated as an Immovable Obstruction (Rule 24-2b). This is a free drop within one club-length of the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole.
There was nothing about it on the scorecard, but the fact that the course staked the trees implies to me that they expect the local rule to be in place. Of course the player didn't ask about it until after he had played (without taking relief).
You learn something new with every round...
Sunday, November 26, 2017
11/26/17 - Balboa
I've played Balboa when it's damp before, but I've never seen standing water on a putting green. Until this morning. There was a substantial puddle on the first green.
Rule 25 (abnormal ground conditions) covers casual water. The water must be visible before you take your stance (this was). Through the green (ie before you get to the green), you get relief if the casual water impacts your swing or stance (not your line). It's a free drop within one club length of the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole
On the green, you get relief if the casual water impedes your swing or stance, or if it is in the line of your putt. On the green, you must place the ball at the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole. Note that this could be off the green.
Note that this means if you are in the fringe, and there is casual water in your line, you do not get relief.
Rule 25 (abnormal ground conditions) covers casual water. The water must be visible before you take your stance (this was). Through the green (ie before you get to the green), you get relief if the casual water impacts your swing or stance (not your line). It's a free drop within one club length of the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole
On the green, you get relief if the casual water impedes your swing or stance, or if it is in the line of your putt. On the green, you must place the ball at the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole. Note that this could be off the green.
Note that this means if you are in the fringe, and there is casual water in your line, you do not get relief.
Sunday, October 22, 2017
10/22/17 - Balboa
It's been a while since I've posted anything. I haven't been playing as much as I would like to, and I haven't been blogging about it at all.
I played Balboa 18 today, and one player hit a putt too firmly, and it hit the flagstick laying on the ground. I was pretty sure that was a penalty, but I wasn't sure of the details.
Rule 17 is all about the flagstick. There are only 34 rules of golf, and the flagstick is one of them. For today, 17-3a was the relevant rule, specifically the underlined portion - "The player's ball must not strike the flagstick when it is attended, removed, or held up." That's a two-stroke penalty, and the ball must be played as it lies.
Of great interest in Rule 17 is 17-4 - Ball resting against flagstick.
Just a refresher here, a ball is holed when it comes to rest at the bottom of the cup. So be careful on your hole-in-one.
Interestingly, I was close enough to the flagstick that I had a thought on attempting to quickly move it. I could not find anything in Decisions on the Rules of Golf regarding whether or not this would be legal. I imagine so.
I played Balboa 18 today, and one player hit a putt too firmly, and it hit the flagstick laying on the ground. I was pretty sure that was a penalty, but I wasn't sure of the details.
Rule 17 is all about the flagstick. There are only 34 rules of golf, and the flagstick is one of them. For today, 17-3a was the relevant rule, specifically the underlined portion - "The player's ball must not strike the flagstick when it is attended, removed, or held up." That's a two-stroke penalty, and the ball must be played as it lies.
Of great interest in Rule 17 is 17-4 - Ball resting against flagstick.
"When a player's ball rests against the flagstick in the hole and the ball is not holed, the player, or another person authorized by him may move or remove the flagstick, and if the ball falls into the hole, the player is deemed to have holed out with his last stroke; otherwise, the ball, if moved, must be placed on the lip of the hole without penalty."
Just a refresher here, a ball is holed when it comes to rest at the bottom of the cup. So be careful on your hole-in-one.
Interestingly, I was close enough to the flagstick that I had a thought on attempting to quickly move it. I could not find anything in Decisions on the Rules of Golf regarding whether or not this would be legal. I imagine so.
Friday, July 21, 2017
7/19/17 - Coronado
A fellow competitor complained about grass clippings around her ball just off the fairway, and I told her that she could brush them away (loose impediments). In doing so, she accidentally moved her ball. Ooops.
This is a violation of rule 18-2, and is a one stroke penalty, and the ball must be placed in the original position.
This rule is under discussion for changing in 2019:
http://www.golfchannel.com/news/golf-central-blog/test-item-graphics/
The proposal would not change what happened above, though. The proposed change is only for instances where it is unclear whether or not the player caused the ball to move (the Dustin Johnson rule).
This is a violation of rule 18-2, and is a one stroke penalty, and the ball must be placed in the original position.
This rule is under discussion for changing in 2019:
http://www.golfchannel.com/news/golf-central-blog/test-item-graphics/
The proposal would not change what happened above, though. The proposed change is only for instances where it is unclear whether or not the player caused the ball to move (the Dustin Johnson rule).
Saturday, June 24, 2017
6/16/17 - Rancho Bernardo Inn
Number 4 at Rancho Bernardo Inn is a long-ish par 3 with a water hazard between the tee and the green. On the green-side of the water hazard, left is out of bounds. There is a drop zone on the green-side of the water for balls hit into the hazard.
So can you use the drop zone for a ball hit over the water and out of bounds?
I say no. A drop zone is always a local rule. The best information I could find on that specific local rule was here:
RBI Men's Golf Club By-Laws
The way I read it, the drop zone is for balls hit into the hazard. In addition, it's optional. I supposed the local rule could be written such that it was mandatory, but I don't believe that is very common.
The same should apply to a lost ball that is not believed to have gone into the water.
Out of bounds penalty is stroke and distance, so the player must re-tee and hit his or her third shot from the tee.
Am I right?
So can you use the drop zone for a ball hit over the water and out of bounds?
I say no. A drop zone is always a local rule. The best information I could find on that specific local rule was here:
RBI Men's Golf Club By-Laws
The way I read it, the drop zone is for balls hit into the hazard. In addition, it's optional. I supposed the local rule could be written such that it was mandatory, but I don't believe that is very common.
The same should apply to a lost ball that is not believed to have gone into the water.
Out of bounds penalty is stroke and distance, so the player must re-tee and hit his or her third shot from the tee.
Am I right?
Sunday, May 7, 2017
5/6/17 - Bonita Golf Club
Rule 24-2 covers immovable instructions, which includes a cart path. A cart path is defined as an artificially-surfaced road or path. Thus this would not include a dirt path, so relief is not granted for that.
Relief is granted if the immovable obstruction interferes with the player's stance or swing. It does not include relief from the line of play (except on the putting green). So if you have to chip over, through, or around a sprinkler head, that's just the rub of the green.
For our last tourney, we put a local rule in place, granting relief from a dirt cart path.
The link below shows pretty well where you should drop.
http://www.golfdigest.com/story/rules-cartpath-drop
Relief is granted if the immovable obstruction interferes with the player's stance or swing. It does not include relief from the line of play (except on the putting green). So if you have to chip over, through, or around a sprinkler head, that's just the rub of the green.
For our last tourney, we put a local rule in place, granting relief from a dirt cart path.
The link below shows pretty well where you should drop.
http://www.golfdigest.com/story/rules-cartpath-drop
Sunday, April 30, 2017
4/29/17 - The Crossings at Carlsbad
My ball crossed the line of a lateral hazard next to a bunker. The strip of grass between the bunker and the lateral hazard was just a couple of feet wide, and sloped towards the bunker.
I was aware of Rule 20-2-c(i), which says that if your dropped ball rolls into a hazard, then you re-drop. Rule 20-2-c(ii) covers the case where you're dropping in a hazard, and the ball rolls out of the hazard (also re-drop).
Since I was racing the sunset, I didn't bother to drop (twice) and then retrieve the ball from the bunker, which was the obvious outcome of dropping it.
I was not aware of Decision 20-2c/3. Decision 20-2c/3 states that you can't take this shortcut. You have to go through the process of dropping twice before placing.
Oops.
I was aware of Rule 20-2-c(i), which says that if your dropped ball rolls into a hazard, then you re-drop. Rule 20-2-c(ii) covers the case where you're dropping in a hazard, and the ball rolls out of the hazard (also re-drop).
Since I was racing the sunset, I didn't bother to drop (twice) and then retrieve the ball from the bunker, which was the obvious outcome of dropping it.
I was not aware of Decision 20-2c/3. Decision 20-2c/3 states that you can't take this shortcut. You have to go through the process of dropping twice before placing.
Oops.
Tuesday, April 4, 2017
Sand and loose soil
Our club handicap shared this. I was not aware. Sand and loose soil are not impediments, and can only be removed on the putting green.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGSwSCF7v24&feature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGSwSCF7v24&feature=youtu.be
Sunday, March 12, 2017
3/11/17 - Riverwalk (Mission / Presidio)
Our monthly tournament was at Riverwalk this month. On the first hole, my second shot went left of the green, and I couldn't tell what was over there. Hazard? OB? Nothing? So I hit a provisional. The provisional landed nicely on the green.
It turns out that my original shot was right by the cart path. It was easily found.
But if I hadn't found it?
If there was a hazard where I believed my ball had gone, then I would have had to drop there, and I would be chipping my fourth shot.
If I couldn't find the ball and there was no hazard, then that would be a lost ball. I would play my provisional, which was on the green laying four.
If there was OB, and I believed that my ball was OB (even if I didn't find it), then I would also be playing my provisional (hitting my fifth shot).
I had tree issues where my original ball was. I was tempted to have not found it, but it was hard to miss. You don't have to spend the requisite five minutes looking for a ball, but mine was hard to miss. So I chipped on, made the putt, and got one of my only pars of the nine. So it worked out okay.
It turns out that my original shot was right by the cart path. It was easily found.
But if I hadn't found it?
If there was a hazard where I believed my ball had gone, then I would have had to drop there, and I would be chipping my fourth shot.
If I couldn't find the ball and there was no hazard, then that would be a lost ball. I would play my provisional, which was on the green laying four.
If there was OB, and I believed that my ball was OB (even if I didn't find it), then I would also be playing my provisional (hitting my fifth shot).
I had tree issues where my original ball was. I was tempted to have not found it, but it was hard to miss. You don't have to spend the requisite five minutes looking for a ball, but mine was hard to miss. So I chipped on, made the putt, and got one of my only pars of the nine. So it worked out okay.
Sunday, January 22, 2017
1/15/17 - Balboa
Rule 14-4 says that it's a penalty to strike the ball more than once in the course of a stroke. This happens to me far more often than I would like. I would really love to see super-slo-mo video to see how the hell I'm doing it. But I hear and feel the ball hit the club while in flight.
It happened at Balboa last week. But it was a bit unusual, and I wanted to look it up. I hit a shot really fat, and on the follow-through, the club hit the ball a second time. But it was actually the first time. I hit the stroke so fat that I really didn't make contact with the ball on the initial part of the stroke. I just chunked a bunch of grass and dirt into the air, and the ball went with it. And on the follow-through, the club hit the ball.
I took the penalty for double-contact, and I figured the rule would cover that scenario. It actually doesn't.
The rule I actually broke was rule 19-2 - Ball in Motion Deflected or Stopped. The penalty is the same (one stroke).
It happened at Balboa last week. But it was a bit unusual, and I wanted to look it up. I hit a shot really fat, and on the follow-through, the club hit the ball a second time. But it was actually the first time. I hit the stroke so fat that I really didn't make contact with the ball on the initial part of the stroke. I just chunked a bunch of grass and dirt into the air, and the ball went with it. And on the follow-through, the club hit the ball.
I took the penalty for double-contact, and I figured the rule would cover that scenario. It actually doesn't.
The rule I actually broke was rule 19-2 - Ball in Motion Deflected or Stopped. The penalty is the same (one stroke).
Saturday, January 7, 2017
1/7/17 - UCSD Casual Golf Club January Tournament - Eastlake Country Club
It was a bit damp at Eastlake with all of the rain we have been getting lately. We covered a few things prior to the round with the members:
Casual Water
Bunkers with Casual Water would play as GUR
No lift clean, and place
What we did not cover was rule 25-2 - Embedded ball. It came up on a par 3, when my tee shot was embedded just off the green. We weren't sure what the rule was, so I played two balls. I played the first one as it lies, out of the severely embedded lie. Then I dropped another ball, and played that from a regular lie. I ended up scoring a 5/2 with each ball, so it didn't matter.
The consensus in the clubhouse was that I should have been entitled to relieve. But Rule 25-2 includes the clause "in any closely mown area...." Since my ball was in the rough, off the green, I was not entitled to relief.
A group can adopt a local rule to allow relief in that scenario, but we had not adopted such a rule.
Casual Water
Bunkers with Casual Water would play as GUR
No lift clean, and place
What we did not cover was rule 25-2 - Embedded ball. It came up on a par 3, when my tee shot was embedded just off the green. We weren't sure what the rule was, so I played two balls. I played the first one as it lies, out of the severely embedded lie. Then I dropped another ball, and played that from a regular lie. I ended up scoring a 5/2 with each ball, so it didn't matter.
The consensus in the clubhouse was that I should have been entitled to relieve. But Rule 25-2 includes the clause "in any closely mown area...." Since my ball was in the rough, off the green, I was not entitled to relief.
A group can adopt a local rule to allow relief in that scenario, but we had not adopted such a rule.
Tuesday, January 3, 2017
1/2/17 - The Crossings
I played The Crossings, and I was only able to finish 16 holes before it got dark. So can I post that score for my handicap?
The answer is yes. If you play 7 to 12 holes, then you can post a 9-hole score. If you play 13 or more, then you can post an 18 hole score.
So what do you do with the holes that you didn't play? You post par plus (or minus) any strokes allowed by your handicap.
My index is presently 20.8. The slope at The Crossings is 125 from the whites. That means my course handicap is 23. So I get one stroke on each hole, and then two strokes on the five toughest holes. Hole #17 is a par 3, and is the number 14 handicap. So I got a fictitious bogey there. And hole #18 is a par 4, and is the number 2 handicap. So a hypothetical double-bogey. I was at 84 through 16 holes, so I posted a 94.
The answer is yes. If you play 7 to 12 holes, then you can post a 9-hole score. If you play 13 or more, then you can post an 18 hole score.
So what do you do with the holes that you didn't play? You post par plus (or minus) any strokes allowed by your handicap.
My index is presently 20.8. The slope at The Crossings is 125 from the whites. That means my course handicap is 23. So I get one stroke on each hole, and then two strokes on the five toughest holes. Hole #17 is a par 3, and is the number 14 handicap. So I got a fictitious bogey there. And hole #18 is a par 4, and is the number 2 handicap. So a hypothetical double-bogey. I was at 84 through 16 holes, so I posted a 94.
Tuesday, December 13, 2016
The Dustin Johnson Rule
There's a new local rule available that would have saved Dustin Johnson from a penalty in the US Open. Your club may or may not adopt this local rule.
http://www.usga.org/rules-hub/2017-local-rule/new-local-rule.html
http://www.usga.org/rules-hub/2017-local-rule/new-local-rule.html
Sunday, December 4, 2016
12/4/16 - Aviara
If you're going to hit a putter laying on the ground when you're hitting out of a bunker, I would recommend hitting your opponent's putter. Per rule 19-3, if you hit an opponent's equipment, you can either play the ball as it lies (no penalty), or replay the stroke.
I hit my own putter. That's covered under rule 19-2. Play it as it lies, one stroke penalty.
So next time I guess I'll leave my putter further away from the trap. Or hit a better bunker shot.
I hit my own putter. That's covered under rule 19-2. Play it as it lies, one stroke penalty.
So next time I guess I'll leave my putter further away from the trap. Or hit a better bunker shot.
Saturday, September 10, 2016
9/10/16 - Carlton Oaks
We had our monthly tournament at Carlton Oaks today. One guy in our foursome hit a ball into the bank above a sand trap, and it came to rest against a rake on the bank. It was clear that moving the rake would cause the ball to roll into the trap.
I consulted with our handicap chairman, who was in the group behind us, and he gave the correct interpretation. Rule 24-1a says that a movable obstruction may be moved, and if moving the obstruction causes the ball to move, then the ball must be placed in the original position, and there is no penalty.
I consulted with our handicap chairman, who was in the group behind us, and he gave the correct interpretation. Rule 24-1a says that a movable obstruction may be moved, and if moving the obstruction causes the ball to move, then the ball must be placed in the original position, and there is no penalty.
Sunday, August 14, 2016
8/13/16 - Salt Creek
I had been told that there were some bunkers that were under repair at Salt Creek, which prompted me to send a summary to the club on Rule 25 - Abnormal Ground Conditions.
A ball in Ground Under Repair (GUR) is a free drop, but if you are in GUR in a bunker, you must drop in the bunker. Alternatively, you can take a one stroke penalty and drop outside the bunker, on a line between the flag and the position of your ball in the bunker.
If the entire bunker is under repair, then you get the free drop outside the bunker (one club length from the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole).
The course was nice enough to put a card in each cart summarizing your options.
For some bunkers they had a red drop area painted by the bunker. I had never heard of that, but I guess it's a local rule for the course, under these conditions.
I never hit into a bunker that was under repair. I did not play particularly well.
A ball in Ground Under Repair (GUR) is a free drop, but if you are in GUR in a bunker, you must drop in the bunker. Alternatively, you can take a one stroke penalty and drop outside the bunker, on a line between the flag and the position of your ball in the bunker.
If the entire bunker is under repair, then you get the free drop outside the bunker (one club length from the nearest point of relief, no closer to the hole).
The course was nice enough to put a card in each cart summarizing your options.
For some bunkers they had a red drop area painted by the bunker. I had never heard of that, but I guess it's a local rule for the course, under these conditions.
I never hit into a bunker that was under repair. I did not play particularly well.
Saturday, August 6, 2016
8/6/16 - Balboa
So this was an interesting one...
On the first tee, one player hit his ball way left, over some trees and onto the 18th hole. I'm not sure if he announced that was hitting a provisional or not, but he hit another ball, landing in the fairway. My tee shot also went left, but not as far as his. From my ball, I saw another ball, which could have been his first one. It was considerably further than his second ball. I was going to tell him about it, but he was about to hit his next (fourth) shot. It would have been rude for me to interrupt him about to hit the ball.
Per rule 27-2b, the provisional ball becomes the ball in play once he reaches the point where the original ball is likely to be. But since his first drive was longer, he hadn't reached that point. So I told him about the ball after his shot. I'm pretty certain that even after playing a second shot with his provisional ball, he could have gone to his original ball and legitimately played a second shot per decision 27-2b/3.
He didn't bother. He never identified the ball that I had found. So I think he was fine playing his fourth stroke from the fairway and abandoning the first ball. That ball was abandoned when he played the next shot with his (formerly) provisional. That shot was a chip from just off the green. He then two-putted for what I would say was a 7. I have no idea what he wrote down.
On the first tee, one player hit his ball way left, over some trees and onto the 18th hole. I'm not sure if he announced that was hitting a provisional or not, but he hit another ball, landing in the fairway. My tee shot also went left, but not as far as his. From my ball, I saw another ball, which could have been his first one. It was considerably further than his second ball. I was going to tell him about it, but he was about to hit his next (fourth) shot. It would have been rude for me to interrupt him about to hit the ball.
Per rule 27-2b, the provisional ball becomes the ball in play once he reaches the point where the original ball is likely to be. But since his first drive was longer, he hadn't reached that point. So I told him about the ball after his shot. I'm pretty certain that even after playing a second shot with his provisional ball, he could have gone to his original ball and legitimately played a second shot per decision 27-2b/3.
He didn't bother. He never identified the ball that I had found. So I think he was fine playing his fourth stroke from the fairway and abandoning the first ball. That ball was abandoned when he played the next shot with his (formerly) provisional. That shot was a chip from just off the green. He then two-putted for what I would say was a 7. I have no idea what he wrote down.
Monday, August 1, 2016
7/31/16 - PGA Championship
I've never been a fan of "preferred lies," or as my club calls it, "lift, clean, and cheat." But they did what they thought was best.
I'm not sure I saw any footage of a pro cleaning his ball in the fairway. Were they not doing it very much, or was the telecast trying to downplay it?
I'm not sure I saw any footage of a pro cleaning his ball in the fairway. Were they not doing it very much, or was the telecast trying to downplay it?
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)